Discussion Forums > General Chatter
Gaza massacre
Dori:
Hi Umair,
I have had religion lessons at my protests highschool, but we learned alone in year 1 about that other religions than Chr. and Jew. After highschool I started to teach myself more about history. Our education level at schools are pretty low. It's not caused by teachers, but our government.
A Dutch writer, Kader Abdollah, has written a book about Prophet Mohammed and rewrite the Quran in Dutch last year. My mother bought it and she did not even read it out. She told me it was very bad written. She is a teacher Dutch, so we don't waste more of our time on that ;) .
Thank you for the tips. Though I will search on my own or contact my Turkish friend. And yes, we have 2 mosques in our city. Last year I was too late for the guided tour, but the food was excellent.
We'll close this subtopic now.
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Poirot, don't you see a difference between Hamas and Palestians? I do.
I know Israel did ask for that, but they never keep themselves on the resolution. They blokkade Gaza Strip. Gaza had never enough electricity and there was a lack of everything.
What would you do in such situation?
You see, you can't blame only one party
T @ r ! Q:
Poirot,
--- Quote ---Looks like everyone on this group is completely agreed about the bestiality of Israel.
--- End quote ---
Well you are a little bit wrong here. We humans are sharing our personal opinions and thoughts here. We are not representing India, Israel, Pakistan here, we are humans. Whenever whereever innocent people are killed, be it anybody's fault,.........its wrong. Thats what we agree on.
If you have read my comments, i myself being a Pakistani have blamed my own countrymen and Arabs also....why? Because i can face the facts and say what i believe is truth.
--- Quote ---no one shall attack us continuously and get away with it
--- End quote ---
I think statement is true for both attacking and attacked sides right?? If yes, then war will continue in a cycle don't you think. It would become a never ending story.
Regarding you being sorry for us Pakis....lets not start it here. Other than Army and mullahs, there live some 160 million human beings here. We know who envy's our fertile land of the Indus basin and planning to block our rivers.
--- Quote ---India does not even have to do anything, we will just watch, in pain
--- End quote ---
A lil piece of advise, while you are busy watching us in pain, ask someone to watch your back, as you know how many separatist movements are there in your country.
Andy Battaglia:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/26/AR2006012600372_pf.html
--- Quote ---Hamas Sweeps Palestinian Elections, Complicating Peace Efforts in Mideast
By Scott Wilson
Washington Post Foreign Service
Friday, January 27, 2006; A01
RAMALLAH, West Bank, Jan. 26 -- The radical Islamic movement Hamas won a large majority in the new Palestinian parliament, according to official election results announced Thursday, trouncing the governing Fatah party in a contest that could dramatically reshape the Palestinians' relations with Israel and the rest of the world.
In Wednesday's voting, Hamas claimed 76 of the 132 parliamentary seats, giving the party at war with Israel the right to form the next cabinet under the Palestinian Authority's president, Mahmoud Abbas, the leader of Fatah.
Fatah, which has dominated the legislature since the previous elections a decade ago and the Palestinian cause for far longer, won 43 seats. A collection of nationalist, leftist and independent parties claimed the rest.
--- End quote ---
The US and Israel refused to deal with Hamas, instead recognizing the minority Fatah as the government of Palestine. Like it or not, Hamas did win a majority in the election.
Israel has had a choke hold over Gaza and this had led to a resumption in rocket attacks on Israel. Israel never held up its part of the ceasefire, keeping borders closed and depriving the area of basic necessities, in a belief that if conditions are bad enough under Hamas, that the people will turn on Hamas. A belief that is strange. It didn't work in Iraq either. Instead it created terrorists where none had existed previously. It doesn't work. It only creates even more hatred. What Israel is doing now is criminal and the callous disregard they have shown for the innocent citizens of Gaza is disgusting and no less heinous than the acts of the recent Mumbai terrorists. Both are utter and random, but the destruction in Gaza is far more extensive, as Israel bombs anything related to government there, with the "collateral damage" destroying mosques and homes and businesses and schools and hospitals without discretion. Acceptance of any of this behavior is acceptance of the idea that humans can ever be anymore than crude beasts.
Poirot:
Andy,
My mistake on the sequence of Hamas and Fatah fighting in Gaza - I was under the *mistaken* impression that Hamas won their elections after ousting Fatah from Gaza. Actually, they started to oust Fatah physically and militarily from Gaza in May 2006, after winning the elections in Jan 2006.
So, you win the elections and then kill your opposition. Nice democratic party, eh?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4983510.stm
Then, there was the whole issue of Hamas not willing to remove "the destruction of Israel" as one of its core aims - why would any sane party negotiate with some one committed to its destruction? I would put the Israeli and the US embargo in this context. Egypt, Jordan, and even S Arabia now recognise the right of Israel to exist - Iran, Syria, Hamas and Hezbollah do not. Why should Israel EVER negotiate with these folks?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas
Did you know that even Jordan has banned Hamas as a terrorist organisation? These matters are not black and white.
Peartree,
If I was dependent on my neighbour for electricity and work, I would not call for the destruction of that neighbour. This is what Hamas has done. If the people of Gaza want to blame anyone for this colossal tragedy in human lives, they have only their own government to blame.
And I am not blaming only one party, but as a neutral observer, I see that over the past ten years Israel has moved a lot in trying to carve up a two-nation state where both the Jews and Palestinians can live in peace. Israel has even used its army to forcefully remove settlers from both Gaza and the West Bank. But, I can see only hostility from Iran, Hamas and Hezbollah in return. When Fatah wants to negotiate a solution, Hamas kills them in a fratricidal civil war.
Tariq,
Dude, whatever.
I know I speak for most Indians, barring a few fundamentalist nutcases who will never set policy in India - we have no desire to take any part of Pakistan into India. Why would we want to depress our GDP and growth?
I really, really wish you guys all the best in dealing with your in-house problems - we genuinely want to see a democratic and stable neighbour. Then, we can just concentrate on eliminating poverty in our country, instead of having to spend 8-10% of our budget on defence.
Everyone,
No offence meant to anyone here and I will not be taking this dialogue any further on my side. I just wanted to present the other side of the picture to everyone.
Cheers
Dori:
--- Quote --- Rockets have been fired into northern Israel from Lebanon, raising fears the Israeli offensive in Gaza may spread.
Israel's army responded with artillery to a barrage of at least three rockets. No group has claimed responsibility.
--- End quote ---
@ BBC News
It's like a powder keg now. I am not sure of they ever thought that this could happen.
:(
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